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by Joe Murgia – @ufojoe11 on Twitter
My comments are in blue.
Jeffrey Mishlove (JM): It’s been widely popularized, going back now for well over a decade, maybe two, that we actually have these vehicles in our possession and have been reverse-engineering them. Do you do you find any credibility to that claim?
Leslie Kean (LK): Well, I mean, that is always one of the ones that I had trouble with Jeff, but in our recent New York Times story, which came out July 23rd, and got a huge amount of attention, we actually brought forward that possibility and we have very high-level sources who have told us that, in fact, there have been retrieved materials and that they are locked away in super-secret programs, very, very highly classified, highly protected. Only a few people know about them, or at least are read into those programs. And these are sources that I’ve worked with for a long time, and I really trust. And so it kind of got to the point, because all of this is an evolution, where my colleague, Ralph Blumenthal, who wrote the piece with me, and I, felt, maybe we’re ready now to take the step into asking that question. I don’t think we could have done it before now. I think there’s been a gradual building up to the possibility of having this happen.
But this was probably the most, let’s say, far out, or whatever, the most risky story we’ve done in our series of pieces for the New York Times. And the most difficult in terms of working with the editors because, as you said, it’s such an extraordinary claim to make and we can’t prove it because we can’t produce the materials.
We can’t show anybody a crashed saucer or anything like that. We have to rely on the authoritative word of people who we trust to know.
And the other thing that I found really interesting was these briefing slides. And we published one of them in the New York Times, where it actually…these are briefings that are presented to, as I said, government and intelligence people, that refer to…not only do they refer to off-world vehicles as a possibility for what these objects are, but they refer to the concern that foreign governments might get advances over us by studying technology that comes from the retrieval of crashed objects, what they call AAVs, Advanced Aerial Vehicles.
And so it’s written there in these briefings that have been going on for a long time, they’re still going on. And the people who have provided the briefings and have written the briefings, and others who have spoken to us off the record, have verified that, yes, this is what they’ve been briefing authorities on and they’re classified briefings.
So we only were on, we only have the tip of the iceberg that we’re able to publish, which is just the fact that these people say this is real and that they are briefing officials about it. We can’t go in any more details than that. But maybe the next step will be somehow we’ll get a little more detail.
You know, it’s a it’s a gradual process. So this has been one of the most fantastical claims as you point out and now it’s sort of becoming a reality, which is quite amazing.
As I’ve stated on Twitter…
If people want 2C SOME of what I think was left out of the NYT GUTTED article on Crash Retrievals, go to my site & check out my four-part, Mega-Blog and articles that followed that.https://t.co/2FyBOA7pQNhttps://t.co/sCxhBOXvWQhttps://t.co/r5fX9bcQqphttps://t.co/lZIOGRySMv
— Joe Murgia (@UfoJoe11) July 25, 2020
…Kean and Blumenthal had their story gutted by their editors. What was left out? Hopefully, we’ll get to see in a future article in the NYT or elsewhere.
One of the sources Kean has worked with “for a long time” is Commander Will Miller. Their relationship goes back to at least 2000 and this Boston Globe article. When I heard the NYT was working on an article on crash retrievals and that might include a segment on the infamous Wilson/Davis notes, I assumed Miller would be part of it and reached out to him to conduct my own interview. I’ve known him since 2000. To me, it was obvious to include such a knowledgable and credible person in a NYT story on crash retrievals. Add in the fact that Kean called Miller “a true insider” in her 2011 book and has known him for at least twenty years and I thought it was was a no-brainer. I don’t know why he didn’t make their cut.
But he made mine! My interview with Commander Miller can be read here. You can also read my four-part Mega-Blog on the Wilson/Davis notes (100% related to crash retrievals) which includes a lot on Miller. I think some of what I wrote about was supposed to be in the NYT article and that includes the 1961 SNIE MJ-12 document.
JM: Well, there are different ways you could view it. On the one hand, might be that we actually have a working vehicle. I think the movie “Independence Day,” for example, portrays that. We have we have captured one of those vehicles and an American pilot actually pilots one in that movie. On the other hand, back in the day, when I was a graduate student working with Professor James harder, he handed me, at one time, a piece of metal. And he said this is a piece of debris that was recovered from a location where one had landed, left marks on the ground, I think radioactivity on the ground and had taken off. And here was, you know, a piece of metal. And as I recall, to his knowledge as a professional engineer, he didn’t think it was an alloy that could be or was manufactured on Earth. I think in your one of your articles, you quote Eric Davis, a physicist who says something similar. He’s looked at material that does not seem to have been manufactured on Earth, some rare metallic alloy of some sort.
LK: That’s right.
As you can see in the excerpt below, in Kean and Blumenthal’s New York Tines article, Dr. Davis also commented on vehicles and not just materials or alloys. To me, there’s a huge difference.
Mr. Davis, who now works for Aerospace Corporation, a defense contractor, said he gave a classified briefing to a Defense Department agency as recently as March about retrievals from “off-world vehicles not made on this earth.”
Mr. Davis said he also gave classified briefings on retrievals of unexplained objects to staff members of the Senate Armed Services Committee on Oct. 21, 2019, and to staff members of the Senate Intelligence Committee two days later.
LK: And you know, we have heard this for a long time and there have been some that have brought forward, but they may not be 100% definitive, or there may be questions in the provenance of the material. But yes, you’re absolutely right. There are materials that have been studied with properties that the scientists feel are very, very hard to explain, that might cost a billion dollars to make on Earth, there’d be no purpose to make them on Earth. There’d be no reason to spend the money to make them on earth and then to throw the piece into the desert. Right? So that’s pretty, pretty remarkable. The problem is, we don’t have the scientific studies on those materials. We don’t have the materials. We’re gonna work more on trying to actually do some reporting on some specific materials like you’re referring to but it’s very, very hard to get something definitive and the reports tend to be classified, the lab studies tend to be classified, if they are in the possession of the government. But it is something we want to try to learn more about and getting something definitive is very difficult, but still, extremely intriguing.
Jacques will have my hide if I speak out of school! Let's just say we progress nicely.
— Garry P. Nolan (@GarryPNolan) October 25, 2020
Later on, the discussion turned to how they might be able to get here. Crash retrievals came up again.
LK: But if you can manipulate space-time and jump through, you know, and I’m not a scientist, but there are there are people who have explained this to me in very simple terms, that it’s almost like taking a piece of paper and folding it and bending it together and you can just zip on through. So, I don’t think it’s difficult for physicists to describe the technology that would allow this to happen. And that’s another very exciting development. And I’ve spoken to some of them myself, and there’s no question that they can explain it. So we have a theoretical model for how that component could work. I think a lot of what they want to really learn more about is the technology itself, obviously. What is it that allows this physical thing to do what they theoretically understand it to be doing.
And if they can…if they have an object that they’ve retrieved? And if they try to reverse engineer the technology? Well, that’s apparently what’s happening.
And I don’t think it’s easy to to understand the technology, from what I gather, but I think that’s obviously what they would want to do if they did have these objects, these crashed objects, obviously. And then the other countries would want to do the same. Who’s gonna get it first?
JM: if you were to take the trajectory from what you’ve witnessed since your book came out 10 years ago, to where we are today, and project it forward another twenty, thirty years, what would you envision?
LK: Oh, boy, that’s an interesting question, Jeff. I would like to envision the secret access programs, that apparently possess physical objects, to be opened up to the public. It’s understandable to me that they may want to keep certain technological discoveries classified, to keep them secure from other countries possessing them.
But, I think the fact that they these objects exist and they have been retrieved, and that we have them, is something that the world has a right to know.
I mean, if one of these objects could be exposed to the world, that would be absolute proof of the reality of UFOs. So, I think, you know, maybe something like that will happen where something really definitive will come out. We still don’t have something. We’re not there yet with something that definitive.
So maybe within twenty to thirty years, something like that will happen, or some kind of documents will be released, that are now super classified, that provide something that we haven’t seen before. The wall we keep bouncing up against is the wall of the classified world, and unless people who own that world are willing to open the door to it a little bit, we’re gonna to continue to move slowly but you just don’t know as we progress, how that might change.
To me, it’s obvious Kean trusts her sources and thinks we have retrieved UFOs. Hopefully, the world gets to see what evidence she and Blumenthal have collected over the years as I think we all have a right to know. Add maybe we’ll get to see one of those retrieved UFOs in all its glory. That’s the only way to know for sure that they exist, we have one and we’re not alone.
Full interview can be watched at the link in the beginning of this transcript.
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